Mary Ann - 22 February 2008 02:03 PM

Re the MySpace stuff, I think the whole MySpace/ reader-generated content thing is fascinating. The question of how that affects/ should affect our reporting and storytelling hasn’t even begun to shake down yet…

Just wanted to report my first real Facebook success on deadline. I needed a couple of a affected university student to speak to a certain issue on Monday afternoon and wrote to about 5 of them on Facebook. One told me to screw off, another I’ve corresponded with and the third I was able to get on the phone and quote in my story. I figured someone here might appreciate .

Mary Ann - 26 February 2008 02:32 PM

ldillon - 12 February 2008 10:53 PM

Lane DeGregory in the St. Pete Times today.
http://tinyurl.com/2kkm4n
Thoughts on dialog? A question I have is if she used a tape recorder to take the conversation while she observed and wrote down body language, etc…

Hey—yep, cool Lane piece. I was curious about the tape recorder thing after you posted, so I wrote to Lane and asked her. This is what she said—not only about recorder, but about how story came to be: 

“No, I didn’t have a tape recorder with me. I wish I had. ... Everything was scribbled quickly on a legal pad as I sat at the table next to them, eavesdropping with their permission. There was a lot of dialog I left out and/or edited out because I didn’t have it all down. I sort of picked and chose my full sentences to write, and could tell the ones I needed when I heard them. But I hadn’t gone into that story with the idea of doing it as a dialog. That was my editor’s idea after I read him some passages from my notes.

“Originally, the story was 75 inches long! He had the foresight to make me chop the top to 1/3 of its narrative (lots of background about them was lost) and focus on the moments between them. The story ran at under 40 inches ... 

“I if I’d known I was going to write it in dialog I definitely would have brought a tape recorder! Luckily, there were a ton of pregnant pauses between mother and son which allowed my left hand to catch up with writing ... “

Proof that great editors exist!

Wow, interesting comments re: editors. And goes to show what I’m missing in Naples ...

I’m wondering also given how she reported it, whether it was as exact as it appears. It reads very much like an on-going conversation. I know there aren’t hard and fast rules on these types of issues, but is it OK to leave some dialog out if it isn’t germane to the point you’re trying to make with the story??? Again given the reporting, it’s difficult for me to see in this case how that DIDN’T happen here.

Tanya Rose - 26 February 2008 02:52 PM

Mary Ann -
A lot of people didn’t like the tone - you’re definitely not alone! I guess I wasn’t thinking of it from the perspective of someone who lives in Detroit (here’s the Post parachuting in and making fun of the situation and by extension, the city and those who live there), but more from an outsider’s point of view. I definitely can see why some folks didn’t like it. But MAN I loved that lede. And I was just so pulled in by the story itself (like you said, those facts are just so amazing).

Though some people in the comments, Detroiters, were saying they’re just so embarrassed by what’s happening and have almost disowned their own city. Those people didn’t seem to mind the tone, maybe because they agree and are just wiping their hands of the whole thing and saying ‘yeah, go ahead, make fun, it’s all true.’ It depends so much on perspective, I think.

If it were printed in an alternative weekly or a publication that caters to a younger audience, I’m guessing it would have gone over better (tone and all)? But in the Post, I think you might be right in that the snark factor was a little much!

Anyway, didn’t mean to get so off topic! I’ll check out the voice threads!

A good discussion. I had read this story a week or so ago and just re-read it. The first time I loved the voice; this time I’m a little more ambivalent. I think the facts the writer presented were completely on point and the importance of making those selections should not be underestimated. Likely, there was a bunch of stuff she left out, but I think what’s there does a great job of telling the story ...

All that being said, perhaps lines like: “Reread that one if you need to, but don’t get stuck! There’s still more.”
& “But wait! There’s still more!”
& “But wait! There’s even still more!”
are a bit too much ...

The material definitely could have carried it otherwise. That means, I suppose, she would have had to find other transitions.

ldillon - 26 February 2008 11:37 PM

All that being said, perhaps lines like: “Reread that one if you need to, but don’t get stuck! There’s still more.”
& “But wait! There’s still more!”
& “But wait! There’s even still more!”
are a bit too much ...
... That means, I suppose, she would have had to find other transitions.

Guys—I just went back to the Detroit piece with Liam’s comment in mind re “other transitions...”
In my humble and aged view, I think those “transitions” above—wait! there’s more -- feed the snarkiness mentioned above, and that one could argue that if you deleted them, the material would still fall into totally integrated place (ie.e, logical this follows that).
Transitions is an interesting topic… what are they? Are they little bridges that connect one thing to another? Are they thematic devices (like above, repeating, “Wait! There’s still more!” as a propulsion device? Are they implied bridges, i.e., one section or story element is completed, and so, on to the next (implied bridge is the completion of the previous, and the beginning of the next?)

I see reporters struggle a lot with transitions ("I need something to get me from here to there....")

Wonder if, when that is the case, you are forcing the connection and maybe need to rethink placement of story elements?

Hey all -
I was thinking about this story and thought I’d post it here… it’s about a severed foot. I can’t really do the story justice by explaining so I’ll just post the link. HA! It ran in the Lawrence Journal World in Kansas. I love this story first because it’s quirky and the type of thing that keeps people talking for weeks, and second because of the way it’s written. I think the quotes are priceless - the type that some reporters might consider throwaways ("It’s cool, it’s all good...")

The reporter could have done a lot of cute things with it, but he didn’t. He wrote it straight, which I like… the story is weird enough without overblown writing. Just thought I’d share!

http://www2.ljworld.com/news/2005/jul/26/amputee_happy_be/

Tanya Rose - 15 April 2008 12:52 PM

H I can’t really do the story justice by explaining so I’ll just post the link. HA!
http://www2.ljworld.com/news/2005/jul/26/amputee_happy_be/

“Rubottom admits it may sound unusual, but to him, that’s part of the appeal. Not everyone, he said, can say he keeps his own foot in a bucket.
“It’s interesting,” he said. “It’s mine.”
Soon after the amputation, news spread. People started coming by asking to see it.

This is hilarious! Tanya—I think you are right. Anything cute (Rubottom isn’t one to put his foot in his mouth kinda thing) would detract. This is straight, but the simplicity of it makes it, like, really funny. Weird. And kind of unsettling and icky. But hilarious, because of the matter-of-fact (almost imitating the guy thinking) voice.
cool!

p.s. to above:

I also love the way she uses the quote from the hospital lady as sort of a “nut graf” (if you’ll excuse the expression):

Karen Shumate, vice president of quality services for LMH, said people are allowed to keep body parts if they want them.
“They’ve had women that want their uterus. People take tonsils. They take appendixes,” she said. “I think it’s unusual that someone would want a foot, but it’s within their rights because it’s theirs.”

It gives the wider-world picture without the reporter coming in like the bull in the you-know-what, and saying, in graf four:

Whether people keep body parts that have been removed is up to the individual, according to experts. There is no law in Kansas saying that a person’s appendix or uterus cannot go home with them, even though doctors and medical specialists warn against the practice. There is no hard data on how many people keep their body parts, according to the American Medical Society, kinda thing.

Some of my reporters struggle with that 100 percent of the time—how do you write a simple narrative, and NOT put in a piece of sh-- nut graf to ruin the tone. 

I think this is a great example of a way to do that.

Amazing five-part series on a rape that happened more than 20 years ago. It’s long but so worth it ...  some of the best storytelling I’ve read in a long time. Maybe because it’s in first person? I don’t know. Either way, worth a read. Found it on Gangrey.

http://www.cleveland.com/beyondrape/index.ssf/2008/05/beyond_rape_a_survivors_journe.html

[quote author="TanyaAmazing five-part series on a rape that happened more than 20 years ago. It’s long but so worth it ...  some of the best storytelling I’ve read in a long time. Maybe because it’s in first person? I don’t know.

wow. ONly read the first part thus far. It is a beaut. I wanna read the rst of it to see just why it is “some of the best storytelling...."”

I think the first person is a huge element. But there’s first person and there’s first person… back later when I read it all!